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Go Back   .:: Bots United ::. > Cyborg Factory > POD-Bot mm > Ideas
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Pagyra's suggestions
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Pagyra
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Default Pagyra's suggestions - 20-04-2010

I apologize if there are problems of translation - translated by Google.

Ideas:

1. Enter the voice chat bots, as is done in standard Zbot - helps in game with human teammates and in during round can mark places where located the enemy for bots - by coordinating joint actions bots.

2. Add possibility of tactics - Rush, Search and Destroy, Wait and Clean, Random,...
Changing tactics allow points team leader at the beginning of each round.

3. Add a habit of bots (with the tactics of waiting and searching) to walk step.

4. Standard tactics of behavior of CT-bots may change but the basis remains the standard. They must protect bombplace, but in the case of finding a bomb that fell or the Bombers call teammate, and still on patrol nearby range. Live teammates will seek out and destroy enemies, but in case of attack teammates rush to him.

5. Add a habit of bots to move closer or along to obstacles and walls.

6. Add a habit of bots try not to shoot from the stairs, adding the desire to rise or down the stairs sooner - to stabilize the shooting.

7. Add a habit to sit down for firing at long distances .

8. In the case of the sniper to move streif and diagonal or zig-zags, hiding behind large obstacles, move towards him. Sitting down and firing 2 bullet between 2 shots of sniper and move at the time when he aims or hidden.

9. If the enemy shield - throw a grenade at enemy feet and moving around enemy and seek to come to enemy side or back. Shooting in the protruding parts of the body and head, especially if the enemy is revealed for the shot.

10. Teach bots shoot burst.

A) Add a habit of bots to shoot a burst from Famas at a far distance, but in the short to try to shoot automatically.

B) Add a habit of bots to shoot a burst of Glock in one enemy at close range, but several opponents at long range try to shoot automatically.

11. To create a realistic behavior of the bot - be a better view of the deviation from the direction of motion was only in the event of fire or hiding at obstakles.

12. If the bot heard the noise - he must look at the most remote but visible by bot waypoint with the shortest path from the point where there was a noise to his current position.

13. If the bot does not see the enemy, but sees that the wall come the bullets, the bot should turn to the enemy firing position.

Native language is Russian, so sorry for bad english.

Last edited by Pagyra; 20-04-2010 at 16:58..
  
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Re: Suggestion
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Pagyra
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Default Re: Suggestion - 21-04-2010

In the FAQ there is an mark in text:
pb_aim_deviation_y (value) - HORIZONTAL (left / right) ... Should pb_aim_deviation_x

Make automatic learning with automatic creation of camp, jump, plant and other waypoints in the game bots with people, preservation of the direction / angle of view. Perhaps this is to modify autowaypoints and increase the limit on the number of waypoints.
Example, camp - stay on one place (region) more than 8 seconds with save the change in direction / angle of view and pozition.

Once tested the bots:
For the test took 3
ZBot (CSBot)
NiceBot
PODBot

The result is very sad on the best settings - PODBot - despite its very cheat habit should be aiming for the enemy through walls lost most realistic ZBot (CSBot), and then having the tactics and aggression NiceBot. The only note that thriftiness PODbots.

Last edited by Pagyra; 21-04-2010 at 11:12..
  
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Re: Suggestion
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KWo
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Default Re: Suggestion - 21-04-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pagyra View Post
In the FAQ there is an mark in text:
pb_aim_deviation_y (value) - HORIZONTAL (left / right) ... Should pb_aim_deviation_x
For angle stuff in HL/CS it's so - y is horizontal (move the crosshair left/right), x is vertical (move the crosshair up/down).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pagyra View Post
Make automatic learning with automatic creation of camp, jump, plant and other waypoints in the game bots with people, preservation of the direction / angle of view. Perhaps this is to modify autowaypoints and increase the limit on the number of waypoints.
Example, camp - stay on one place (region) more than 8 seconds with save the change in direction / angle of view and pozition.
I don't have any good algorithm to make auto covering map with waypoints. Changing the current navigation method would need to recode the whole bot (I don't have time for it) with losing the functinality (door opening by buttons, lift usage, jump etc).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pagyra View Post
Once tested the bots:
For the test took 3
ZBot (CSBot)
NiceBot
PODBot

The result is very sad on the best settings - PODBot - despite its very cheat habit should be aiming for the enemy through walls lost most realistic ZBot (CSBot), and then having the tactics and aggression NiceBot. The only note that thriftiness PODbots.
I have tested podbot mm against CZERO bot and I've got 90% efficiency of podbot mm bots comparing to CZERO bots (I mean - CZERO bots = 1000 frags, podbot mm bots = 900 frags i.e.). The only comparable test is under CSDM - when the money doesn't affect the weapon the bot may have. Otherwise that affect next results in next rounds - if the team is losing at the beginning - with that skill CZERO bots have it's impossible to get back to the good money state.

Last edited by KWo; 21-04-2010 at 21:34..
  
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Re: Suggestion
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Pagyra
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Default Re: Suggestion - 26-04-2010

As for everything else - you try to do it?
  
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Re: Suggestion
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KWo
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Default Re: Suggestion - 28-04-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pagyra View Post
I apologize if there are problems of translation - translated by Google.
No problem. I'am able to understand almost everything You wrote - not that bad like You think it could be.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pagyra View Post
Ideas:

1. Enter the voice chat bots, as is done in standard Zbot - helps in game with human teammates and in during round can mark places where located the enemy for bots - by coordinating joint actions bots.
That works correctly with ZBOTS (CZERO bots) only on default maps. How they react on custom maps - how they can tell You where they are?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pagyra View Post
2. Add possibility of tactics - Rush, Search and Destroy, Wait and Clean, Random,...
Changing tactics allow points team leader at the beginning of each round.
I like this, but I have no idea yet how to implement it in code.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pagyra View Post
3. Add a habit of bots (with the tactics of waiting and searching) to walk step.
If the 2 is done, this one would be easy to add. But first I would need more time (which I miss) to solve 2.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pagyra View Post
4. Standard tactics of behavior of CT-bots may change but the basis remains the standard. They must protect bombplace, but in the case of finding a bomb that fell or the Bombers call teammate, and still on patrol nearby range. Live teammates will seek out and destroy enemies, but in case of attack teammates rush to him.
That is still concerning to tactics. Yes this bot is missing tactics code, but that would need more time to figure out how to make them more human-like.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pagyra View Post
5. Add a habit of bots to move closer or along to obstacles and walls.
They are using waypoints and it's up to a waypointer how he is doing waypoints. If waypoints are placed in center areas - they go there. If waypoints are placed near walls, they go there. The code checks only which waypoints are more danger, so bots are trying to use the safest path (at least some of them).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pagyra View Post
6. Add a habit of bots try not to shoot from the stairs, adding the desire to rise or down the stairs sooner - to stabilize the shooting.
I believe even on stairs they still aim better than You and humans, so that shouldn't affect much the gameplaying...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pagyra View Post
7. Add a habit to sit down for firing at long distances .
I have to think of it. It shouldn't be very hard to implement that into the code.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pagyra View Post
8. In the case of the sniper to move streif and diagonal or zig-zags, hiding behind large obstacles, move towards him. Sitting down and firing 2 bullet between 2 shots of sniper and move at the time when he aims or hidden.
Yeah - that is also reasonable. I have to think of it (how to do it).


Quote:
Originally Posted by Pagyra View Post
9. If the enemy shield - throw a grenade at enemy feet and moving around enemy and seek to come to enemy side or back. Shooting in the protruding parts of the body and head, especially if the enemy is revealed for the shot.
At least that part with throwing a grenade near the enemy should be easy to do (if the enemy is using the shield)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pagyra View Post
10. Teach bots shoot burst.

A) Add a habit of bots to shoot a burst from Famas at a far distance, but in the short to try to shoot automatically.

B) Add a habit of bots to shoot a burst of Glock in one enemy at close range, but several opponents at long range try to shoot automatically.
There are only 2 such weapons like that, so I don't think it's eanough worth my time to think of it...


Quote:
Originally Posted by Pagyra View Post
11. To create a realistic behavior of the bot - be a better view of the deviation from the direction of motion was only in the event of fire or hiding at obstakles.
That I didn't understand. Please - rephrase.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pagyra View Post
12. If the bot heard the noise - he must look at the most remote but visible by bot waypoint with the shortest path from the point where there was a noise to his current position.
I like this idea, but then the bot would change the direction to look at all the time. The question is - how to determine which noise should affect the bot (to force them to look at that direction) and which one shouldn't? Another thing is - it would require a lot of calculations to do each frame (to find that closest visible waypoint), so it would negatively affect the server performance.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pagyra View Post
13. If the bot does not see the enemy, but sees that the wall come the bullets, the bot should turn to the enemy firing position.
You have to know one thing - the bot doesn't see the world around him like You do. The code calculates if the bot should be able too "see" the enemy, if he is in a distance he should "hear". So the bot doesn't see everything around him, but the code just is focusing on some more important objects (like players, weapons, obstacles). Bullets don't belong to that group, so bots aren't reacting on them. Because there is a lot of bullets around bots (since everybody is firing almost all the time), that would need to make a lot of calculations if any of bullet could be "visible" or not by a bot (and that would again negatively affect the server's performance). I believe after that explanation You understand the dificultiness of implementing Your idea.
  
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Re: Suggestion
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Pagyra
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Default Re: Suggestion - 29-04-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by KWo View Post
That works correctly with ZBOTS (CZERO bots) only on default maps. How they react on custom maps - how they can tell You where they are?
Voice chat bots is done by exhibiting special labels for the regions with waypoints in ZBOTS (CZERO bots)
Quote:
Originally Posted by KWo View Post
I like this, but I have no idea yet how to implement it in code.
For realization tactics for all bots may want special to change is desire bots to follow / cover for teammates, in depending on the chosen tactics.
Might be inclined to make bots for joint action by the pair. Protection and cover each other in a pair and dividing the opponents in range and armament.
Also, you may want to display the individual pairs formed aggressiveness. A surviving single bot desire to re-organize the pair. And the desire to be near the bomb had dropped.
In other words, do the tactics on the basis of changes in priorities during the round, depending on events.
Quote:
Originally Posted by KWo View Post
That I didn't understand. Please - rephrase.
in other words -
Bots need to try to look in the same direction where they move, except if they both move and fire with the enemy or hide behind obstacles
Quote:
Originally Posted by KWo View Post
I like this idea, but then the bot would change the direction to look at all the time. The question is - how to determine which noise should affect the bot (to force them to look at that direction) and which one shouldn't? Another thing is - it would require a lot of calculations to do each frame (to find that closest visible waypoint), so it would negatively affect the server performance.
I agree about turning on the sound and negatively affect the server performance ... then it is possible to put only the effect of the closest sounds (except those that created teammates)?
Quote:
Originally Posted by KWo View Post
You have to know one thing - the bot doesn't see the world around him like You do. The code calculates if the bot should be able too "see" the enemy, if he is in a distance he should "hear". So the bot doesn't see everything around him, but the code just is focusing on some more important objects (like players, weapons, obstacles). Bullets don't belong to that group, so bots aren't reacting on them. Because there is a lot of bullets around bots (since everybody is firing almost all the time), that would need to make a lot of calculations if any of bullet could be "visible" or not by a bot (and that would again negatively affect the server's performance). I believe after that explanation You understand the dificultiness of implementing Your idea.
But it is possible to catch the same appearance near the bot decal holes from bullets, sounds, sprites ricochets, flares and smoke(while there was no alarm from the bot).
  
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Re: Suggestion
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AlexBreems
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Default Re: Suggestion - 04-05-2010

Suggestion:
separate list of names for bots into parts for T and part CT
very useful when simulating clan wars, etc.
  
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Pagyra
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Default Re: Suggestion - 05-05-2010

At the this moment there is only one type of bots with the same priorities, aggression, team play and the choice of type weapons.
You can do several different "types" bots?
Snipers, rusher, camper, random - with different for each type of bots, in priorities, aggression, team play and the choice of type weapons.
  
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-={SR}=-Reaper
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Default Re: Suggestion - 07-05-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pagyra View Post
At the this moment there is only one type of bots with the same priorities, aggression, team play and the choice of type weapons.
You can do several different "types" bots?
Snipers, rusher, camper, random - with different for each type of bots, in priorities, aggression, team play and the choice of type weapons.
I can already do this with the bot pb_menu.
and i can set there priorities and aggression with the pb_menu.
i use randome choich and all bot's are diffrent in there actions and weapons.


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Re: Pagyra's suggestions
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Pagyra
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Default Re: Pagyra's suggestions - 12-05-2010

It is worth to introduce a more obvious differences of behavior between types of bots, denoting for each type of habits in tactics of behavior.

Snipers must be preferred to use the camp waypoints, but to be the most aggressive on the behavior, but try to work in pairs(average teamwork). Prefers to move a step. Neutral type of bot - rushes to the goal with the battle.

Rusher maximum aggression and minimum teamwork. Looks, but does not use camp waypoints, prefers to run. Attack type of bot - rushes to the goal with the battle.

Camper minimum aggression and minimum teamwork. Must be preferred to use the camp waypoints, prefers to move a step. Defensive type of bot - defends the area.

Random average aggression and maximum teamwork. Looks camp waypoints, prefers to run. Attack type of bot - uses the tactics of hit and run, hitting the enemy (but not killing, or when it detects multiple opponents) try to get around.
  
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