V1_rocket_b2 request waypoint

[xgzoq]

Hello,everybody here!
There was a winter map named v1_rocket_b2
the story line:Winter 1943. In a daring attempt to fight the axis with it's own weapons the allies have managed to capture a v1bomb. Now the allied forces must escort a Lorraine37L carying this stolen v1rocket into an axis rocketbase, steal the rocketfuel and launch the rocket deep into Axis territory.
Here is a link to it: http://69.93.98.218/downloads/etmain/v1rocket_b2.pk3

If someone whoever have a spare time waypointing for v1_rocket_b2, i'll really appreciate it!

[TomTom]

Yes I remember doing a Bobots1.03 waypoint on this map, enjoyable but big. Took another look, did a walkthrough, should be better in Fritzbot with or without lever controls I think. Looks like there are 2 TOIs available for special scripting requirements and a few that could be reassigned if needed. That means that the bots can respond based on the position of the half-track-V1 from the spawn to the train-yard as well as the position of the V1 rocket rail-cart. Teams should be 10-13+ I suspect but final testing will determine that.

Now I have no real time for a few weeks, but if nobody takes it on by December I'll see if I can post a playable WIP for Christmas. Please note: I am not promising to take any new waypoints all the way to release status anymore. So you would have to play test it and provide feedback. In the meanwhile if you want something to do, try writing up a strategy file (description of stages of game play and defensive positions).

[xgzoq]

"So you would have to play test it and provide feedback. In the meanwhile if you want something to do, try writing up a strategy file (description of stages of game play and defensive positions)."
Okay,i'll try as soon as i can.
Looking forward to hear from your good news about playable WIP for Christmas.
Thx in advance,TomTom!

[TomTom]

First function test is showing some issues. Allied engrs seem to only fix from behind the Lorraine supply tractor. If they are beside it they act like if they think it is fixed and needs to be escorted. I am going to try adding a parallel one way path centered on the vehicle to force a rear approach like in saberpeak. Beyond that I would have to investigate the related bsp entities.

The 2 stage bridge TOI only triggers re-building if dynamited twice (total destruct) and only triggers dynamiting if construction completed ("bridge reinforced"). I would need a lot of script resources (say 3-4 fake TOIs) to fully communicate the bridge state to the bots including the 2 of 4 states when it can be crossed. I looked at fueldump but in that map the bridge is less consequential to the match play so I guess that is why the bridge dynamite actions seem to remain inactive. One workaround might be to change the script to completely destroy the bridge with just 1 dynamiting so as to speed up the rebuilding.

Because of the problems giving the bots knowledge of when the bridge is half built and can be crossed, along with no other quick way for the allies to get to that side of the gate I have decided to do a very class based defense initially so that axis bots don't vacillate between camps and roams on different sides of the bridge. Axis engrs and medics on one side, Fieldops, soldiers the other, with cvops in reserve. Likewise Allied engr-support camps on the far side will be dependent on the state of the bridge.

[TomTom]

Did some more bridge testing (trying to find a way to script to set the state of an added func_construct to a constructed state) then went back to re-confirm my observations from the earlier tests and found I had some of them wrong. The engineers will respond correctly to the half-built / half-destroyed states. That only leaves the other bots and the aiscript to deal with. I think one fake construct for the half-built state may suffice.

The problem with the lorraine repair is not so pronounced in normal teams and play, I may just have to deal with it in some locations.

I think I can share the fake construct of the lorraine positions with the closed state of the door to the fuel. So I figue 3 TOIs, 3 fake constructs, 5-6 func explosives and the two door lever (4 trigger multiples and 2 target script triggers) could suffice (18 scripted entities!). If that proves too many to be stable then the levers will be sacrificed.

One other observation, Axis Fieldop bots are not smart enough to know that air support refuse to fly through tunnels

[xgzoq]

hey,TomTom.Glad to see u and your first WIP for v1_rocket_b2 before Chrisma!
i have test it just now,have to make a little suggestion here for u.i hope u like it!
first of all,of course,i would like to see actions around bridge become more comfortable for axis or allied after bridge testing once and again.but please pay attention to some other aspects like forzen river.At begining of defense main entrance,i noticed axis always jump into the river during the fight,then it costs much time for axis to got a way to return to the ground.
in my opinion,u would better to refer to look into waypoint files for transmitter which made bots could not fall to the river from the constructable bridge.i think if make sure axis or allied don't have to worried about falling to the river during the fight near the bridge,meanwhile axis engineer prefer defending the main entrance with weapon to dynamiting bridge,the fighting of main entrance will be more exciting and better.
As to allied,attacking the main entrance,allied engineers go forward to the main entrance while some others invade into the base through the rear path cross the river,right.but actually the action of rear invaders capture the flag had not happended?maybe u have set the flag action actived after main entrance breach.but personally as long as the allied captured flag,their respawn engineer can dynamite on the main entrance inside and that will be easy for allied to escort the tank.
After the tank had reached the depotyard,allied go for the flag or just stick at depotyard instead of stealing or deliver,i suspect key actions have not been included in this version of WIP,expecting to see that in next version as soon as possible!
and i have another suggestion:Once the tank reached the depotyard successfully,made the flag owner allied permanence.i'm surely axis have to strong their defense line like using mg42 or camping on the top of the base near the fuel while we will watch that allied go along three tunnel ways to the fuel base.oh,that will be great fight waiting for us!!
Well,i will make more suggestion about improving WIP after testing once and again if have spare time,i hope next version will be release as soon as possble.
keep up your work,man!!

[TomTom]

Hey xgzoq thanks for your input. Sorry to disapoint you but I am a few days at least from first WIP so what you must have tried out was 0.01 which is TEST. Just a partial waypoint for evaluating vehicle escort-repair-destruct and some pathing (specifically the bots on ice cause it is difficult for them). So at this stage of test all axis bots are attracted to any roams, camps and vehicles on the allied side. That will be changed shortly (and later on the fight for the fuel will be added). It is important that the bots be able to get off the ice quickly because bots that are fighting do not remain at a camp nor do they follow nodes. Now in this map any axis bots that come under fire in front of the gate will pursue their attacker if they are within bot sight and will likely pass on to the river. The only way to stop them going to the river would be to put up invisible walls (fakebrushes).

Yes I will eventually try to support inside dynamiting. However getting bots spawning at both spawns will take additional script resources and I do not get to chose what class or bot spawn where. Indeed the class order of respawning may mean it will be impossible to split a class between spawns. Now it would be easy to just make all the bots spawn inside when the allies capture the flag but I think you would like the attack to be 2 sided. This is where a strategy description is useful (attached file describes a possible first stage only).

"another suggestion:Once the tank reached the depotyard successfully,made the flag owner allied permanence"

I was thinking of class limiting the flag recapture to axis cvops at that point since they should also do the command post. Then if the axis have the flag they would defend the fuel and the tunnel entrances. If they lose the flag then the axis fall back to heavily defend the fuel and lightly defend the tunnel exits/launcher area.

Update; OK I found a spot for the new scripted team_WOLF_objective between the depot and initial house spawn. And it looks like a mix of classes including one in three engrs will respawn at the depot with the rest at the initial spawn (assuming all the team respawns at the same time, otherwise it fills the first 4 in the old spawn then the next 6 in the depot then splits the next 2 after that...).
And I now have all the scripted entities done, all path nodes and fixed objective actions placed. So if you have favorite camps or strategies now is the time to say since defining the action groupings is next on my To Do list. (Routing will be delayed until initial testing is completed but should be roughly defined in the strategy file before then)

[TomTom]

Ok first WIP posted. Find the link Here then follow it to the bottom of the next page. (I will move the file to its own directory later so use the 2007 projects page if I don't link it on the main page.)

Strategy is not complete nor implemented so there are still camps that can be added. There are no routes yet so don't expect bots to use alternate entrances/exits. Ramp deliver defense is sparse, deliverer support non-existent, and bots will still be fighting for the flag so their focus will be divided at the end. Bots ignore the door controls cause they are just low priority roams (I might use alt-roams later, but do not plan on anything like fake steals that would be overkill).

Please report back any engr bots zombied beside the tractor carrier. I have mostly solved the problem with a special path from behind but there maybe splines (run_xx messages in console) that are problems as the carrier moves by more than 1 at a time. Don't worry about any node connection warnings (anticipated). I have not seen any no goal message for the last 3 test games but they may be possible nonetheless. Thx for your help.

[xgzoq]

i have tried out newly first playable WIP.yeath,allied bot could won the game after steal and deliver action supported now.thx TomTom!
but i think it will be necessary to improvement on many aspects.
let's talk about the fight for main entrance.during the match,we can see some cases that not expected.
1.the allied prefer chose rear way into the base and not constructed allied side mg42 until the tank crossed bridge or further while the axis always cross the river to the allied side to attack madly even spawnkilling!so u can see the tank was laying on the road far from the bridge or near bridge but 10min left only.
2.the allied engineers escort the tank near the bridge and prone to construct bridge while axis at the main entrance defending at other side of bridge.allied usually failed to construct it completely,even a lucky one did it,axis engineer dynamited on it at once.then some strange happened axis still jump onto the river to dynamite after the bridge destroyed completely?
3.allied really like to go for rear path to capture the depotyard,but it seemd that i havn't seen allied respawn at depotyard well as u expected and after a while axis reseized the flag.allied engineers kept on chosing dynamite at main entrance inside. but 9 of 10 times failed if just one axis engineer roaming in the base.
so i have to make conclusion that the strategy for allied using rear path to blow main entrnace earlier than regular ways was not practicable method.
Fortunately,i got another plan:Only activate rear path for allied engineer if allied pay attention to mg42nest and the tank that cross the bridge under the main entrance and allied engineer tried to dynamite at the face of main entrance failed many times.Of course,i don't object to the rear path for allied cvops to capture flag if u can make sure the flag respawn do function well for allied.
Well,let our views transfer to main chapter on the map.i was afraid that i had seen allied engineers sticking at depot calling:"escort vehicle!" after the tank reached at depot successful?
after tank reached at depotyard and the electric train ready to go to the ramp.the allied always go to the depotyard through shortcut instead of tunnel ways while axis owned flag.the allied often crowded at the door which only way to outside and easy for axis to kill one by one.until last min of the match they kept on fighting for flag sometimes!
when allied owned flag,axis forced to strengthen defense,but it seemed impossible for axis engineer which roaming outdoor to construct the radar mg42nest when he tried in vain to climb up the ledge near the nest?even if mg42 constructed,never seen any axis use it?the fuel lightly defense maybe too weak if the axis repawned at depotyard and some allied lucky sneak into the fuelbase.
So my suggestion is coming out:when the train go for the ramp and axis still owned flag,Active lightly fuelbase defense.split the respawn,one or two axis repawn at depotyard while more ones at main bunker ready for defending in the tunnel and nearby the fuelbase;when axis lose flag,Active heavily reforced defense as well as lightly defense:split respawn,one or two near the radar the others at main bunker,need do more defense into the fuelbase like landmine planted,fuelbase mg42nest,sniper at top of the mountain near the fuelbase or so on.BTW no matter whether axis lost flag or not the axis main bunker mg42 should be first considerble defend spot.
The switch of front gate for bots using near the fuel was a pretty idea!but i'm afraid no allied noticed that.
Actually allied attacking to the fuelbase needs to do more improvement and strengthen.
oh,if i think of some idea for allied attacking,i will share with u if i'm free time.

[TomTom]

Thank you for the feedback.
in reply:
1 - In order to focus the allied bots on dynamiting the gate I reduced the priority of constructibles (like the bridge and mg42). That way the dynamite is at least as high priority as the bridge but unfortunately the mg42 is reduced to a priority similar to planting mines. But that should be OK since the bots don't need the fixed mg42's in this map and the allied mg42 is very vulnerable. I can always turn off the construct of the mg42 earlier so it does not get built when the gate is blown but then again for now I just like to think the bot is acting a little like an XP whore and building it for the engineering XP.
As for the axis the class defense strategy is not properly implemented yet so a few bots may be crossing at that point that should stay nearer the spawn.

2 - Are you sure the bridge was totally dynamited? It take 2 dynamites and if the second is laid after the first one blows there is only a narrow edge left to dynamite. So far I have observed the axis dynamite that narrow edge reasonably well, but I will monitor it in future. As to the Allies they will have difficulty now building the bridge since the axis bots will seek to own that area to prevent the tractor getting to the otherside. I may assign more axis camps inside the tunnel reducing those at the tractor, however the tractor is a magnet for all bot classes (though with different priorities).

3 - The rear dynamite can still be practical but the allied engrs likely need support camps (current there are just a couple of medic roams).
Making the bots change strategy after a set number of dynamite plants is a very interesting idea and can be done in the script file, but it would require another func_explosive entity to signal the aiscript when to change. Now this map already has a lot of scripted entities, so to be safe I will leave this idea for much later when everything else is complete.
The spawning in the depot will happen but as I tested only when the bots respawning exceed 4. I can likely change this but it will affect the number spawning for the bridge adversely. I think I will leave this for later when balance testing starts.

".the allied always go to the depotyard through shortcut"

As I said NO routes have been added, I want the bots to be more predictable until we can be certain that their current behavior is correct before adding the random element of routes.

"but it seemed impossible for axis engineer which roaming outdoor to construct the radar mg42nest when he tried in vain to climb up the ledge near the nest?"

Thank you very much that is exactly the sort of feedback I need. I had not time to verify that path with bots yet, will try to fix it ASAP.

"even if mg42 constructed,never seen any axis use it?"

Correct I made it a non camp mg42 action. Later when I force the allies to run to the ramp to support the fuel carrier that is when I should change the action to a fixed mg42 camp.

"So my suggestion is coming out:when the train go for the ramp and axis still owned flag,Active lightly fuelbase defense.split the respawn,one or two axis repawn at depotyard while more ones at main bunker ready for defending in the tunnel and nearby the fuelbase;when axis lose flag,Active heavily reforced defense as well as lightly defense:split respawn,one or two near the radar the others at main bunker,"

Agreed but it takes another scripted entity so I first want to be sure things are stable first.

"need do more defense into the fuelbase like landmine planted,fuelbase mg42nest,sniper at top of the mountain near the fuelbase or so on."

These already exist, but more will be added (except mines - over 10 total can crash FritzBot ET). Initially I want to keep the number of camps smaller until the strategy definition is done. The bots chose camps at random, they do not consider things like too many defending one spot and not enough the other spots, so too many camps can actually weaken a defense if not careful ( It depends on team size and classes)

The switch of front gate for bots using near the fuel was a pretty idea!but i'm afraid no allied noticed that."

They won't as I explained, but when I do the routes then bots that do not get fired on may open/close the door (TBD). Beyond that I would have to make the allies zigzag always when running for the open wall.