Podbot Beta 3.0 Updates? ^^

[mattisbogus]

Originally Posted by PauliusBa

The stopping stuff makes mots look very unnatural. I think that the required angle should be increased.

I do believe in randomness. Some stuff just should be random - tactics, whether bot stops for a turn, chat behavior..

I waypoint, but the bots tend to use same paths and it is very difficult to manipulate with waypoints so they would use more ways possible in a map.

A big bug is hostage rescuing. In cs_max, there is a hostage on a box. Bots don't rescue them because they probably think that they need to be in the same elevation level.

I like your randomness idea, that is really the only major problem I have with podbot is their tactics. They are very predicable most times, and tend to go the same routes over and over. I waypoint my own maps usually, for maps I cannot find waypoints for or they are very badly done, and there is many places on the map that are useless because the bots never want to go in that direction. They look like they stick to their experience file and go the same paths over and over. I have tried changing the danger factor value and it doesn't seem to make them anymore random.

[KWo]

New update - V3B20i:

+Added new functionality for pb_latencybot cvar. Now when You set it to 2 it starts to show virtual random ping for bots (experimental - doesn't work perfectly - when the scoreboard get updated by new frags, for 1 second all pings for bots are disappearing, then they are there again). Thanks to MeRcyLeZZ
+Changed the delay time bots would answer to chat messages (that should prevent bots to overflood the chat area). I need to think how to make a better randomization for "start" talking (probably finally I'll ad a cvar for that).
+Added new function when the bot is falling down, it should press "use" button (to support parachute AMX/AMXX plugins).
+Added - when the first player joins a server and there are bots only, the round is restarted in 5 seconds.
+Removed experimentally the check for dead players if the user is with NOCLIP movement flag.

Please test it and leave a feedback here. Especially that feature with "use" button pressed when the bot is not on the ground (probably it will do the same while jumping) should be havilly tested.

[CS1.6]

Test results:

(The tests were made on two individual servers. A basic CS server and a modded plugin filled server)



green = acceptable status
red = needs immediate attention


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• The new pb_latencybot function

First of all good job! I tell you many many users will get high if they see this new function in podbot. This was their uber wish since years. They won't believe their eyes that this function is finally present. (They just have to know about the update!)

That beeing said there is room for improvements imo:

It seems to me that the bots ping value is related to the players ping. So it happens that when a player with 330 ping is on server, they have very high pings. When i am there they have very low pings. Often 10 ping.

For various reasons this is not the optimum imo.

You have to know i have been using Mercylezzs plugin since the beginning and thus believe to know the best way to set it up.

Firs of all, when i "the admin" am on the server, it's understandable that my ping is so low. But all other players having pings around 10, too? It's a bit weird isn't it?

Then there are cases when players or even so called laggers join with a ping over ~300. Isn't it weird that the bots have a ping like 200, 300 or even more but yet they play like someone with a low latency? They don't lag while moving, their bullets hit you much faster, etc. You see those pings yet they play like someone with a heavenly ping. It's a contradictory.

So my suggestion / my conclusion :

Set the bots ping to something like 30 - 50. These pings are common on servers since steam (and most users) naturally scans all servers for >50 ping. That's a realistic (good) cs player ping. And i think it's perfect to "mask" bots. It's low enough to explain their lack of lag during gameplay and it's a high enough ping to "simulate" a human player beeing on a cs server. Another reason to have bot pings in these ranges, is that i just don't like to see botpings of 100 or 200 only because there is/are some laggers from the other side of the world on my server. Then it looks like a "lagger server" from a kid at his parents home.

Here, use this version:

http://www.speedyshare.com/files/212..._death_msg.sma

It is the fixed & perfect version that i use. The phenomenon of pings desappearing after a kill is fixed. You should also use my settings. Or you might even offer all features of the plugin in podbot itself, for the admin to choose. Will propbably be very appreciated by alot of uses.




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• The new bot chat delay time

Indeed the bots do chat less and slower. Yet too much chat for me. I am not sure if i will ever use this function. As i understand this function is supposed to make the bots look more realistic, like human players. Players don't chat that much. They chat rarely and in that case: "lol" "thx" "n1 shot" etc.

Of course there are human discussions but you can't emulate that and neither their topics. The only "repetitive" and sowith somehow emulatable thing are those once in a while "lol", etc. as stated above. So i personally would let 1 bot chat every 60 seconds with a "lol" or something to make them look like humans.




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• The new function of bots pressing "E" when falling

I don't know exactly for which plugin or mod this function is supposed to be and to be honest i wonder if it's not better to have this function in a simple amxx plugin (if possible) since this is a specifically amxx plugin related function. Because other than this mod (which i dont know), this new function is not used at all and would be in podbot as a unused code.

I tested this by picking bots up the air via jedigrab, i also threw them in the air but in no case could i hear a "use" sound from the bots.




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• The new funtion of sv_restart 5 when player joins the server

I know why you made it 5 seconds. It's meant for the time that the user needs from joining server and getting into a team but unfortunately this is not that simple. I linked you the thread with the problematics beeing abit covered there.

example from my tests:

1. Ok, so i joined the server..went to SPEC to see what happens.
2. [sv_restart 5 was sucessfully triggered btw..]
3. A little bit later Player joined the server and joind a team.
4. Guess what happened? Nothing. Because i was allready on server (not in any team though). He had to watch bots play for long time. I had to respawn the player via UAIO plugin.


The checks has to be like this:

- if player joins a team (& no human in teams) -> sv_restart(round) 1


a few scenarios as an example:

1. Player1(afk) joins server but doesnt choose any teams at all(afk). Player2 joins server, joins a team. Nothing happens. He has to watch bots play.
2. Player1 joins server, he then joins spectators to see the game. Another user joins server, then joins a team. The round is not reset since Player1 was allready on server. (And this is exactly what happened in the test)
   

A last thing on this topic: If there is CSDM running, this function should be disabled! Because the player is respawned automatically. It is not of high importance but it would be more ideal. The player could this way join and play without the sv_roundstart disrupting the ongoing gameflow in CSDM.





_____________________________________________

• The deletion of the unecessary NOCLIP code in podbot

It works perfectly. No more unecessary botkill after player goes into NOCLIP.

Another cool thing:
I gave even bots NOCLIP. All these years if you would have given bots NOCLIP they were frozen and wouldn't do anything anymore. Wow, for me that was exciting to see bots even move and play in NOCLIP mode. After all those years i was used to see only real players beeing able to do this. This might be really interesting for studies on bot gameplay. To see how they kill and play in this new totally new dimension that exists for them now.





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Additional feedback on this new release:

• The reason why all bots autodie on as_ maps after human VIP reaches target

Now that the NOCLIP autodie function is gone i was surprised to find out that the bots still autodie after human VIP reaches target (with him beeing the only human in game).

I set pb_autokill = 0 and this didn't happen anymore. So we learn that after VIP player has reached the target he is set to an "dead state".




_____________________________________________

• New bug: Server crash on as_ maps if bots killed by "Kill all bots" or "New round" via the podbot Menu.

Player gets the following message:

You have been disconnected from the server
Reason: Server shutting down

HLDS crash message:






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• New Bug: Bot number balance issues

Pre-information: My pb_minbts = 0

pb_minbots 0
pb_maxbots 8
pb_bot_quota_match 0

Allthough more and people join the server, bots are not removed. So even if i have 8 or even more humanes on server, the bots are still there.

When i kick all bots, they all rejoin. (pb_minbts = 0)






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General feedback on podbot:

• Too many Bot Radio Messages

Pre-information: I am using the new podbot.cfg. My original cfg file had bot radios turned off for years now.

I just joined the server and heard since a long time ago bot radio messages and it reminded me why i turned them off years ago. Similar to bot chats, the radio messages are overflowing and intrusive, too. I mean for every action by every bot in your team a radio message is just too much, man. It's a constant radio spam. How can you concentrate and play like that? So i would "suggest" a code in podbot which calculates a 0% to 100% chance of giving out a bot message or not. Or you add a cvar where the user can decide. Like: pb_radio_chance 0 - 100 or pb_radiomssgs 0 - 100. All in all the bot radio messages should be at a rate that doesn't annoy.

[mattisbogus]

Amazing stuff KWo, again thank you so much for your efforts in continuing to develop such a project.

I will start testing this build immediately, because I run the parachute plugin on my server, and bots do seem to fall sometimes from lets say, de_rats and for them to use a parachute as well, that is amazing

EDIT:

Some results I have already are that bots are not being removed regardless of pb_minbot value.
Example: My settings:
pb_minbots 3
pb_maxbots 15
pb_bot_quota_match 2
pb_bot_join_team "t"

but only adds the max bots, and doesn't kick to min bots.

Also the new ping feature I think is excellent idea, only it looks a bit unrealistic only because the ping updates seem much to quick.

Also the "use" function, I find this to be an amazing feature because I have some mods which allow you to shoot RPG, plant land mines etc, and sometimes when they using parachute, they also set land mines and fire RPG because it's command is also "use" key. But I see a problem with "use" key is that it seems when they are coming down ladder they are using "use" key, but I have waypointed my maps well and most bots do not fall so I can't report they are using "use" key properly. I tried slapping them over the edge and they just die, but that isn't realistic so I don't know if it's working right yet.

[sacripan]

Very good ideas, parachute, chat ... but as long as the number of bots gift do not work as before. Impossible to test this version

[KWo]

New update - V3B20j:

+Changed the functionality of the virtual ping (now it gets random from 30-50 range value; before it was fluctuating about the average ping of humans). Still it doesn't work perfectly - when the scoreboard get updated by new frags, for 1 second all pings for bots are disappearing, then they are there again).
+Fixed auto add/kick bot function problem.
+Fixed function when the bot is falling down, it should press "use" button (to support parachute AMX/AMXX plugins) - now it doesn't do that on ladders and does really when is falling down only.
+Changed - when the first player joins a team on the server and there are in T and CT teams bots only, the round is restarted in 5 seconds.


I cannot confirm any bug with as_xx maps when the function kill all bots is used. I tested it couple of times on as_oilrig with 23 bots and it didn't crash, so I guess there is some interference with some plugin on CS1.6 server - the same crash will happen (more than likely) with any older version of pb mm (and probably with other bots having this function, too).
Radio and chat messages weren't changed in this build (I was focused on bugfixing only).

Please test it and leave a feedback here. The feature with "use" button pressed when the bot is not on the ground still neeeds to be tested.

[CS1.6]

Originally Posted by KWo

New update - V3B20j:

+Changed the functionality of the virtual ping (now it gets random from 30-50 range value; before it was fluctuating about the average ping of humans). Still it doesn't work perfectly - when the scoreboard get updated by new frags, for 1 second all pings for bots are disappearing, then they are there again).

Fixed successfully! I don't even see the pings disappearing after a death message. It works perfectly as in the fixed version of Mercylezz plugin. You still see pings disappearing?

Originally Posted by KWo

+Fixed auto add/kick bot function problem.

Fixed successfully!

Originally Posted by KWo

+Fixed function when the bot is falling down, it should press "use" button (to support parachute AMX/AMXX plugins) - now it doesn't do that on ladders and does really when is falling down only.

Originally Posted by KWo

Please test it and leave a feedback here. The feature with "use" button pressed when the bot is not on the ground still neeeds to be tested.

Fixed partially. Again i picked the bots up in the air and this time you clearly hear them triggering the use button once they are in the air. It seems also that the more near they are to the ground they more often they trigger the use button - but i think that is just a mere perception.

But it seems they trigger the use command constantly ..even on ground and of course while jumping. I vaguely assumed it might have to do with the unevenness of the ground surface and after further testing i think this assumption is true. Sometimes there are "bumps" and "tiny hills" on the ground and as soon as the bot leaves the ground for a millisecond when he walks over them, it triggeres the use function. Same principle applies to when the bot runs down a decending ground structure ..like in de_dust1/2 ..where you run "downhill" on many map areas.

I am not really a big fan of adding plugin or mod specific codes into podbot. Mods are used and popular for a while but sooner or a bit later they are forgotten and no one plays them. Those codes though will remain as unused dead codes in the podbot body. And that's the view that people fail to see in their temporary high for a mod. They don't look ahead what will happen to podbot once the mod is gone and forgotten. So i would allways suggest to realize those kind of wishes via amxx plugins.

There are many mods of much higher statue which podbot is not compatible with (like soccerjam where bots are basically zombies). Amx Parachute is rather a small plugin to be considered worthy of podbots internal code beeing manipulated for.

Also i wonder in which map is this going to happen? Because ..have you ever thought about that for the bot to jump from a roof it needs a waypoint telling the bot to jump from the roof all the way down? Which map has something like that in its waypoints!? For sure not the default waypoints that come with podbots. And custom maps don't have such waypoints, either. So you basically need to totally rewrite all waypoints for each map anew. And what's even more fatal, is that you can't use those waypoints with regular CS either, since the use of such waypoints in CS would render the bots make suicide jumps constantly. So you cant just edit the waypoints and distribute them in the All-in-one bot package either, because bots would make suicide on all servers left and right.

I say give this beta to that person and make him happy but forget this whole thing. That was an unthoughtfull suggestion by whoever requested it and he can't be someone who really cares for podbot, because you don't request to have podbots internal codes to be changed and prostituted for such a bot unrelated, little plugin like that! And on top of all, it wouldn't even work. My time was wasted for nothing and KWos, too.

Originally Posted by KWo

+Changed - when the first player joins a team on the server and there are in T and CT teams bots only, the round is restarted in 5 seconds.

Fixed successfully! But i urge you to use 1 second delay only. Once the player is in a team, he is ready and wants to play. There is no need for further delay!

Originally Posted by KWo

I cannot confirm any bug with as_xx maps when the function kill all bots is used. I tested it couple of times on as_oilrig with 23 bots and it didn't crash, so I guess there is some interference with some plugin on CS1.6 server - the same crash will happen (more than likely) with any older version of pb mm (and probably with other bots having this function, too).
Radio and chat messages weren't changed in this build (I was focused on bugfixing only).

You are right!

I don't know how i failed to do this test on the basic Cs server. I could have sworn i have done it. In the testing i must have mixed up the servers. The crash appears when those two plugins are run together. I narrowed them out. Also i was right in my theory that the plugins which would cause such a crash must have been death (message) related since the crash only occured upon bot slay.

One plugin drops players secondary weapon after death as well .
The other plugin fades the players death to red once he dies.

In the previous version there were no such conflicts with the two plugins andi assume it has to do with the new ping death message code in podbot.

Here is the link to the two files:
http://www.speedyshare.com/files/212...lrig_crash.rar

You should take a look in their codes and find out why it causes podbot to crash and why it is in as_oilrig. I wouldn't consider this the end of this problem, because there are alot of death message related plugins outthere.

[mattisbogus]

+Changed the functionality of the virtual ping (now it gets random from 30-50 range value; before it was fluctuating about the average ping of humans). Still it doesn't work perfectly - when the scoreboard get updated by new frags, for 1 second all pings for bots are disappearing, then they are there again).
+Fixed auto add/kick bot function problem.
+Fixed function when the bot is falling down, it should press "use" button (to support parachute AMX/AMXX plugins) - now it doesn't do that on ladders and does really when is falling down only.
+Changed - when the first player joins a team on the server and there are in T and CT teams bots only, the round is restarted in 5 seconds.


I cannot confirm any bug with as_xx maps when the function kill all bots is used. I tested it couple of times on as_oilrig with 23 bots and it didn't crash, so I guess there is some interference with some plugin on CS1.6 server - the same crash will happen (more than likely) with any older version of pb mm (and probably with other bots having this function, too).
Radio and chat messages weren't changed in this build (I was focused on bugfixing only).

Please test it and leave a feedback here. The feature with "use" button pressed when the bot is not on the ground still neeeds to be tested.

The ping on scoreboard looking great, much more realistic. Other than split second update for frag, most people will never even notice this.

Auto add/kick is working again, thank you! This is huge with my server

Bots using "USE" key is working much better than before. They use anytime they are falling now, but will also use if uneven ground (i.e. Walking up bridge on cs_assault) and they also will use when jumping. However, this doesn't stop me from using this build! I am very excited with this build my server going crazy now with bots shooting RPGS, planting land minds etc, and now using parachute! This is so awesome my users love it.

I have to disagree with not putting this into podbot. This has been suggested many many times for a very long time by different people. Even if you don't like the idea, I still think this should be configured into podbot as maybe cvar so if people don't like they can just disable. Even if map is waypointed very well, bots will still fall from places and this can stop this. This also gives a whole new play style if the user decides to waypoint the map differently making bots use routes that were never possible with podbot before. Although I see your point, in it being, why code podbot just for one plugin. But the more plugins podbot is compatible with, the more ideas and things people can come up with that were not bot friendly before.

Also for as_ maps sorry I can't comment there as I never play them.

Overall, I am so happy with podbot right now KWo, your doing an amazing job

[KWo]

Originally Posted by CS1.6

Fixed partially. Again i picked the bots up in the air and this time you clearly hear them triggering the use button once they are in the air.

Do You mean if You are putting them in NOCLIP mode?
About small plugin, not used so often... Look here:
http://forums.alliedmods.net/showthr...ight=parachute
Have You seen how many times it was downloaded?
I agree most of functions they should be used/equipped by bots, they should be implemented in the specific plugin as aa support for bots. But this particular plugin with this specific situation - probably cannot know what the bot is actually doing, so probably it's much more easy to add that support for using parachutes by bots inside the bot code (the code knows better when it is really needed to realize "now the bot is falling down - he needs to use a parachute". If it will not be working as I want, I'll add a cvar to switch it on/off.

Originally Posted by CS1.6

Fixed successfully! But i urge you to use 1 second delay only. Once the player is in a team, he is ready and wants to play. There is no need for further delay!

OK. I can reduce this time, but please test it longer to make sure it really works correctly in all situations. As I wrote You on pm - I'm having troubles to recognize is CSDM working or not. I have to figure it out - probably with my CSDM beta version (I don't think it will be ever fixed in the original CSDM version).

Originally Posted by CS1.6

You are right! I don't know how i failed to do this test on the basic Cs server. I could have sworn i have done it. In the testing i must have mixed up the servers. The crash appears when those two plugins are run together. I narrowed them out. Also i was right in my theory that the plugins which would cause such a crash must have been death (message) related since the crash only occured upon bot slay.

One plugin drops players secondary weapon after death as well .
The other plugin fades the players death to red once he dies.

In the previous version there were no such conflicts with the two plugins and i assume it has to do with the new ping death message code in podbot.

Well, actually I cannot make everybody happy. If there is too many messages sent at once - it may cause a crash. That's why the amount of running plugins on the server should be limited to the really needed minimum. Icannot promise if I'll find the time to figure out that problem with Your plugins. Did You switch off Your pingfaker plugin since my bots show now the ping them-seves? Maybe here is the problem (2 times sent the same SVC_PINGS messages with the interference with those 2 plugins)?

[CS1.6]

Do You mean if You are putting them in NOCLIP mode?

No.. i can grab an entity and pick them up. Like players, weapons on the ground, etc.

Well yea, that's alot of downloads.

OK. I can reduce this time, but please test it longer to make sure it really works correctly in all situations.

It works. No reason why it shouldn't. The Player is connected and just joined team to play. Besides i have 1 second in connors plugin for years now, as you can see in the .sma .

Well, actually I cannot make everybody happy. If there is too many messages sent at once - it may cause a crash.

If you read carefully, no one asked for any support for those plugins. I said go through the codes to have a better understanding why podbot crashes. I have plenty of alternatives to use instead of those plugins. But i think that it is not ok for podbot beeing so unstable regarding death messages intefernces by other plugins which is very common. Just those two plugins are enough to crash the server. Mercylezzs plugin was off obviously.